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	<title>Comments on: Modernaire Strike&#160;Back!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/</link>
	<description>Independent and alternative music in Scotland - with a shitload of gin.</description>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5006</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 May 2008 14:15:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5006</guid>
		<description>Yes, exactly.  I am not saying that I want to stop the fella using the sketch, I am just saying that when I saw that he had it felt weird: I had a brief proprietary instinct that I had to remind myself to quell.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, exactly.  I am not saying that I want to stop the fella using the sketch, I am just saying that when I saw that he had it felt weird: I had a brief proprietary instinct that I had to remind myself to quell.</p>
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		<title>By: Drunk Country</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5005</link>
		<dc:creator>Drunk Country</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 May 2008 14:12:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5005</guid>
		<description>um, didn&#039;t you say a loooong way back (when you were displaying your &#039;in work but not doing any so am buggering about drawdin instead&#039; wares) that people could do whatever they wanted with your sketches?  I haven&#039;t bothered to lok back through the posts to check if that statement is indeed correct, but I do remember something along those lines being floated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>um, didn&#8217;t you say a loooong way back (when you were displaying your &#8216;in work but not doing any so am buggering about drawdin instead&#8217; wares) that people could do whatever they wanted with your sketches?  I haven&#8217;t bothered to lok back through the posts to check if that statement is indeed correct, but I do remember something along those lines being floated.</p>
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		<title>By: Campfires &#38; Battlefields</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5004</link>
		<dc:creator>Campfires &#38; Battlefields</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 May 2008 12:53:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5004</guid>
		<description>Hurn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hurn.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5003</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 May 2008 11:56:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5003</guid>
		<description>Erm, yes, no way anyone could accuse that of being anything but entirely sensible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erm, yes, no way anyone could accuse that of being anything but entirely sensible.</p>
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		<title>By: Campfires &#38; Battlefields</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5002</link>
		<dc:creator>Campfires &#38; Battlefields</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 May 2008 01:31:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5002</guid>
		<description>Fecalith?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fecalith?</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5001</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 May 2008 00:25:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5001</guid>
		<description>Erm, C&amp;B, pull yourself together and say something sensible you arse.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erm, C&amp;B, pull yourself together and say something sensible you arse.</p>
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		<title>By: Campfires &#38; Battlefields</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-5000</link>
		<dc:creator>Campfires &#38; Battlefields</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 May 2008 20:37:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-5000</guid>
		<description>All music emanates from the precious wounds of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, and all those who seek to profit therefrom shall buuuuuurnnnn!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All music emanates from the precious wounds of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, and all those who seek to profit therefrom shall buuuuuurnnnn!</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-4996</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 May 2008 12:30:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-4996</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s true.  You &lt;i&gt;know&lt;/i&gt; it&#039;s yours when it reality it isn&#039;t really.  But the relationship between artist and audience is clearly symbiotic.  I just particularly struggle to understand the extent to which you should have to relinquish control once you publish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s true.  You <i>know</i> it&#8217;s yours when it reality it isn&#8217;t really.  But the relationship between artist and audience is clearly symbiotic.  I just particularly struggle to understand the extent to which you should have to relinquish control once you publish.</p>
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		<title>By: Euan</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-4997</link>
		<dc:creator>Euan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 May 2008 11:43:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-4997</guid>
		<description>I agree with the idea that the album is yours til you put it out in the public domain where it then becomes everybody elses to share and enjoy.  There is a big difference though between letting go of the music ona personal level and letting go of the rights to the music.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with the idea that the album is yours til you put it out in the public domain where it then becomes everybody elses to share and enjoy.  There is a big difference though between letting go of the music ona personal level and letting go of the rights to the music.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://songbytoad.com/2008/05/modernaire-strike-back/#comment-4999</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 May 2008 09:08:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://songbytoad.wordpress.com/?p=1633#comment-4999</guid>
		<description>I am not saying that you have to surrender all rights or that anyone has to just offer something up to the world and then give up on it.  What I said was that there is a degree to which, as soon as you are asking other people to interact with your creative enterprises, that you &lt;i&gt;have&lt;/i&gt; already surrendered a degree of ownership.

If you want to keep your art, whatever it is, shut in your house and just do it for your own sake then that&#039;s fine, but as soon as you put it out into the world people are going to create their own meanings for it and have their own interactions with it - you can&#039;t and shouldn&#039;t have any right to demand to influence this interaction.

So I am not saying that you surrender authorship or give up all right to determine how the work is used, but there is still a degree to which this is true and necessary.

The examples you cite are a bit different to what I&#039;m talking about, too.  One is simply a direct misquote, a lie, as I never said that.  Flatly misrepresenting someone&#039;s position is just dishonest, but it&#039;s not a question of copyright or ownership.

Lifting the review wholesale is also simply plagiarism.  A more appropriate analogy would be simply reprinting my reviews as Song, by Toad reviews in their paper and then selling that paper.  This is almost exactly analagous to what we do on music blogs: we use other people&#039;s stuff and give them full credit.  For the most part the arguments are the same too: up to a point it would be hugely beneficial to me to have my reviews printed verbatim and credited in The Sun, but there would come a point where I would have to start to ask myself why they were making money from my writing and I, irrespective of credit or audience received, was not.  Where that point lies though is anyone&#039;s guess.

Here&#039;s another example: one of my readers recently changed his Facebook profile picture to the Toad sketch I have in the blog header.  My initial reaction was &#039;Hey, that&#039;s mine!&#039; but if I&#039;d used an EH Shepard sketch myself would I think I was doing something bad?  Probably not.  There&#039;s no credit or benefit to me and no attribution, but do I have the right to ask him to stop?  I don&#039;t know, but it would feel a bit weird doing it and I don&#039;t think it would be right, somehow.

I am not saying there is a dogmatically right view on this, but an artist&#039;s work is not exclusively their own from the second they invite other people to appreciate it: it becomes, to a limited and undefined degree, a shared thing at that point.  To what extent?  I don&#039;t know, I&#039;m still trying to get my head around that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am not saying that you have to surrender all rights or that anyone has to just offer something up to the world and then give up on it.  What I said was that there is a degree to which, as soon as you are asking other people to interact with your creative enterprises, that you <i>have</i> already surrendered a degree of ownership.</p>
<p>If you want to keep your art, whatever it is, shut in your house and just do it for your own sake then that&#8217;s fine, but as soon as you put it out into the world people are going to create their own meanings for it and have their own interactions with it &#8211; you can&#8217;t and shouldn&#8217;t have any right to demand to influence this interaction.</p>
<p>So I am not saying that you surrender authorship or give up all right to determine how the work is used, but there is still a degree to which this is true and necessary.</p>
<p>The examples you cite are a bit different to what I&#8217;m talking about, too.  One is simply a direct misquote, a lie, as I never said that.  Flatly misrepresenting someone&#8217;s position is just dishonest, but it&#8217;s not a question of copyright or ownership.</p>
<p>Lifting the review wholesale is also simply plagiarism.  A more appropriate analogy would be simply reprinting my reviews as Song, by Toad reviews in their paper and then selling that paper.  This is almost exactly analagous to what we do on music blogs: we use other people&#8217;s stuff and give them full credit.  For the most part the arguments are the same too: up to a point it would be hugely beneficial to me to have my reviews printed verbatim and credited in The Sun, but there would come a point where I would have to start to ask myself why they were making money from my writing and I, irrespective of credit or audience received, was not.  Where that point lies though is anyone&#8217;s guess.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s another example: one of my readers recently changed his Facebook profile picture to the Toad sketch I have in the blog header.  My initial reaction was &#8216;Hey, that&#8217;s mine!&#8217; but if I&#8217;d used an EH Shepard sketch myself would I think I was doing something bad?  Probably not.  There&#8217;s no credit or benefit to me and no attribution, but do I have the right to ask him to stop?  I don&#8217;t know, but it would feel a bit weird doing it and I don&#8217;t think it would be right, somehow.</p>
<p>I am not saying there is a dogmatically right view on this, but an artist&#8217;s work is not exclusively their own from the second they invite other people to appreciate it: it becomes, to a limited and undefined degree, a shared thing at that point.  To what extent?  I don&#8217;t know, I&#8217;m still trying to get my head around that.</p>
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