Music 2.0 Social Rambling: jeremy warmsley's new thing jo whiley jools holland laundromatinee mtv phil chevron radiators radiators from space vh1 welcome to our tv show
by Matthew
57 comments
Toad 2.0
Future of Digital Media
Don’t worry, I’m not going to be tackling anything quite so ambitious in the space of a mere handful of paragraphs, so don’t worry. You can read on without fear of impending pomposity.
Basically, I was reading this little piece in the Guardian about the future of digital media, and it got me to thinking about music on television and stuff like that. Basically, there isn’t any decent music on television, is there? Jools is okay, I guess, although I find him personally annoying and don’t like many of the bands he features. There’s the kiddie ones on weekend mornings too, I think – T4 or something like that must have one. There’s also some Jo Whiley thing or other, but I can never sit through more than a few minutes of that without feeling compelled to swear at the screen and throw crisps around the place. MTV and VH1 are music-based, but don’t seem to be actually about music, so to speak, as far as I am aware.
So there are things out there, but I find myself thinking about something genuinely ‘about’ music. Something with a bit of actual content beyond music videos and trying to reflect the whims of Teh Kidz(TM). Something, I suppose, like a blog – a vlog, I think they’re rather clumsily called. Something with some chatter, some new stuff, some old stuff, a bit of news, some thinking – stuff like that. Something, I suppose I am rather self-indulgently saying, that I would want to watch. Something for actual music fans, which is where a lot of the current stuff seems to be missing the mark just slightly.
And this is where the above article comes in. Basically, the chief reason this imaginary program of mine doesn’t exist, I would speculate, is because it is too niche. It would never command enough of an audience to attract the kind of advertising to keep it afloat, particularly if nudged into the sort of antisocial time slot to which that kind of niche programming tends to be restricted.
But, as Clay Shirky says, that is no longer much of a restriction. With digital television there is a hell of a lot more room for specialist programming. Hell, there are whole channels devoted to nature documentaries, teaching, sci fi and god knows what else, so someone somewhere must be on the verge of offering time and space to a really good program for music fans. But that’s not what intrigues me at the moment, no, it’s YouTube.
Jeremy Warmsley had a bloody good stab at it with the brilliant Welcome to Our TV Show, which is currently airing its final episode on MySpace:
Welcome to our TV Show 7.2 Gossamer Albatross/Elysian Quartet
Pitchfork have also created a TV channel of sorts, which looks rather promising. But the bit that interests me is more the Jeremy Warmsley WtOTS angle. Basically, a bit like the Toad Sessions, he kind of just did it, whether there was an audience there or not. There are other examples of similar programmes springing up on YouTube, garnering an increasing audience and turning out to be rather successful.
So the old problems of niche programming seem to have almost entirely vanished. There are the problems of time and professionalism and budget, but even Pitchfork’s stuff is pretty damn DIY. Basically, there is a real opportunity there to bypass TV altogether and create a multimedia channel all of your own, without the approval or say-so of anyone – the chance to innovate – it’s really fucking exciting. Or at least, sort of.
Needless to say, major record labels are living up to their time-honoured tradition of hating innovation, fearing new ideas, and showing artists no fucking respect whatsoever. Here’s a quote from Jeremy Warmsley describing one of the reasons he is not going to do any more episodes of Welcome to Our TV Show:
If you’re asking me for a precise statement: my own live recordings, made with full permission of the artists in question, complete with release forms signed by the artists in question, were removed by Blogger. I e-mailed them asking them if they wanted to see scans of said release forms but never got a response.
Brilliant. They can try, of course, but ultimately they can’t stop it. Jeremy has a New Thing. Other people are joining in, like My Old Kentucky Blog in the States, who recently launched Laundromatinee. So here we go. There might finally be some music television worth watching in the very near future.
The Radiators – Television Screen
I really want to do more video on the site, Euan, and I’d tackle something like this in a heartbeat, but I just don’t have the time. Making movies is incredibly time-consuming, and I can barely manage as it is.
I will be trying to get more video on the site in general, though.
Then you should try and get somebody involved who can do all the recording and editing for you. It’s time consuming, but if it’s something you want to do, there’s definitely a way to do it I’m sure.
But barts corner would be a hit. he could sit in a rocking chair and correct you every now and again…
It’ll be interesting to see where TV goes with the rise of the Home Theatre PC and the even more prevalent super games console things that now stream media to and fro which are already starting to pick at the way television (and other media) is distributed. It’s only a matter of time before this sort of thing becomes common place and with custom RSS feeds people just get the stuff they want on their TV whether through legitimate means or otherwise. I guess my point is one of the barriers to all the internet based television, that you can’t easily watch it away from your computer, is already starting to disappear.
I really like the stuff Warmsley, Pitchfork, Black Cab Sessions etc are doing and it’s been some time since I’ve watched any live TV (there’s no aerial in our flat).
Well that was a fairly geeky way to pop my S,bT cherry…
Music TV pish…why would you want to bother?
Shity sound…. shity picture, especially if you’re going down the DIY approach.
You’re doing a grand job Matthew…. don’t bite off more then you can chew….
And who’s this fucking Bart character…. people go on about him like he saved the world….pah!!!!
This is a kind of non-debate in the digital age, really. We all know that nationwide music television shows are pish & rightfully ignored by the majority of the tele-going public. There’s a variety of reasons for this (just look at the cock that ends up on 4Music or shits into life as the Channel 4 Unsigned Band ‘talent’ competition), but the main one is (as you say) there’s too much music out there to appeal in a broad sense any longer.
What does seem to work are the local TV music shows serving up geographically specific music/features on bands visiting the area, etc.
The interweb certainly has opened up the medium of DIY music review/showcase broadcasting (Vimeo has had its fair share of contributors to this new medium for some time) &, even though these are simply point camera/record session endeavours, Hear Ya, Luxury Wafers & Daytrotter are more than doing their job to digitalise the revolutions.
It’s funny, I think I mentioned before that I’ve harbored an idea of a livestreaming camera in the studio during broadcast (obviously recorded & posted for posterity), to capture TWoTH & I hard at ‘it’ + any interviewees/sessioners what may wander by. My obstacles are (a) tech know how/equipment availability & (b) time.
These things will come, though, as the show evolves. It’s getting there (tonight’s is going to be a fucking cracker, what with the new theme & everything). It’ll be interesting to see how S,bT embraces the opportunities as & when they free up.
Are you posting it on here again, DC? Is your login working properly?
Can I just say “Vlog the Impogler”?
I thought of it for no reason when I read that bit of the article and it’s making me giggle.
(When I say no reason – obviously I associated Vlad with Vlog because they both begin with otherwise the fairly uncommon “Vl” prefix, the rest just came naturally.)
Other than that I have nothing of substance I want to add to this discussion at the moment, apart from when we put Bart in the rocking chair, can we give him a pipe and smoking jacket?)
Did you hear the story about when Val Doonican did a TV special from the top of Ayres Rock (It wasn’t called Uluru in those days)? Apparently the aborigines were so incenced by the desecration of their sacred land they sneaked up behind him and sent him slaloming down the side of the rock in his rocking chair!
Respect.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=EwEk62HViIA
anyone seen this before…..i shat myself
Toad – I haven’t even tried it, to be honest. I will shortly to satisfy the curiosity. You cool for me to post?
Absolutely. Just listening to NYE one now…
You cool for me to post too?
Not just randomly, when you feel like it, no.
Bret from the great old Post-Punk Junk blog did a great set of 20 or so Post-Punk Junk videos on a public access TV channel in Los Angeles back in the spring and early summer of 2007. He’s fallen quiet again, but there’s a youtube channel where all the videos can be watched. It’s brilliant I think.
And I couldn’t post even if I wanted to (or change my avatar for that matter) because my login is fucked like a 16-year-old boy in John Wayne Gacy’s basement.
nice
There you go, C&B, try that. And maybe that high-pitched whining noise in my ear will go away once and for all.
Now was that so hard? But I still can’t change my avatar.
How about now?
matthew. i think it’s really fucking great. much like music, i don’t care if the production is less than polished. if the quality content is there and you can find the time then go for it. there are so many good examples of diy film makers and up coming filmmakers working on limited budgets who create wonderfully interesting work. i’m all for it mate. personally love the toad sessions and don’t think your lack of experience in the editing suite deters me from watching.
Are you talking about C&B’s avatar Euan?
It’s Puddles, Dylan. Not C&B. Puddles.
blah blah blah
What happened to that funny 70s-porn-looking bloke on your avatar, Puddles?
There is no Puddles there is only Zuul!
thats nearly funny
My avatar has been hijacked! I’ve never felt so violated in all my life (Well, except for that one time in Barbados).
Well you’re back again, so Wordpress is obviously picking up something from your local machine. So in other words, if you want to change your avatar, it’s your problem, not mine.
Oh I’ll change my avatar alright. Just you wait and see. Mwaah, haaa, haaa, haaa!
Cuntfires and Embezzlefields.
Nice to see Puddles’ porn star is back.
beef curtains
I too am excited by this type of thing (music channels/programmes via the net, not changing one’s avatar or beef curtains, although both of those things are not without their intrinsic excitement) and its there for the taking, but of course you need time, which is something I’m not surprised you have little of, given you run this site and have a Proper Job and stuff.
So, why don’t you put an advert up in the College of Art and see if anyone fancies running it for you, somebody there is bound to have media experience, be interested in music and want to do something like this for their CV, for their own interest or as part of the degree. Stick an advert up, see how many applications you get and do some interviews if a choice needs to be made.
This is a bit far out maybe, but you could perhaps even get them (the ECA) to run it as part of their degree programme (so says my bassist and former ECA student anyway). It even has the Wee Red Bar on site as a potential venue, but, really, someone needs to use Edinburgh’s naturally stunning architecture (like Vincent Moon did with Paris on La Blogetheque) for something like this.
No doubt, the readership of the blog can help out with aspects – like I bet Euan could find a way of getting you access to some nice Council owned properties for this sort of thing…
Anyway, in short, you need to delegate it to someone who has the time, enthusiasm and knowhow and you can lend the audience, webspace, kudos and support of Song, By Toad.
What say you?
The gentleman in question was not a “porn star,” Dylan. He was (and, as far as I am aware, remains) one half of the legendary Vancouver musical duo Canned Hamm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KzLC0BvCEw
Please show the proper respect.
As for teamturnip’s suggestion, this sir is what we in the White House call a “no-brainer” or, if you will, a “slam dunk.”
TT’s suggestion is a good one indeed. I am still a bit much of a control freak to not be nervous about it, but it is a very good suggestion.
The problem with things like that comes with how to push the appropriate kudos someone’s way, how to keep them happy for long enough to really build something, and how to divvy up any pitiful amounts of cash we might be able to attract in recompense.
Still, if you find a like-minded soul, that would make a massive difference.
i think most forms of music tv (or whatever term you want to use) actually detract from the music itself, and will do more so if it ends up (regardless of intention and motives) being ham-fisted and amateur hour……
one question keeps going around my head…. what would it add to a blog like song, by toad?
Well, you could just set up a totally separate video blog, have TT’s students run it with your loose supervision and according to your objectives (in other words, you pick the bands, arrange the venues, etc.), and then just have links on S,bT to the videos that are made. If it doesn’t work out, just don’t link to it. And if it does work out, you could handle it in basically the same way you’ve been handling DC’s recent podcasts. No?
Well, Tom, I’m not talking about changing anything too radically. But it would be nice to be able to do more Toad Sessions and more interviews with video, and at the moment the major stumbling block is the video editing, which takes ages.
I like C&B’s idea of a separate blog, and for payment… well, perhaps in music? Dunno.. but a college type might find your archives interesting and on that other blog you could also put up a paypal donation button and/or put ads on it. That would keep this blog ad-free and make it clear that the only for-profit venture would be the other one and only for the purpose of paying staff, not for your own personal gain, ya see? I myself, could justify such a venture, while I couldn’t exactly justify justify taking in monies for my personal blog (just my own feeling on the matter, no offense to those who run ads on theirs) xoxo
I think in terms of rewards, kudos or remuneration you’d have to make it clear that there are no rewards or remuneration, but hopefully the applicants woudn’t be in it for the money anyway.
If its a student or group of students then it could be used as an example of their work for future jobs or could lead on to other opportunities (see below), you’ve got to be in it to win it.
In terms of handing over creative control, Matthew, I can understand that that would be a big deal given the time and effort you have invested in the blog. The only thing I can say to that is that the most “successful” (and I don’t mean financial success necessarily) people in life are good delegators, they know when to delegate and who to delegate to. That’s why you interview to try to ensure that you know whether someone is going to be any good. Easier said than done perhaps?
Well, that’s why you get in touch with ECA and get them to run it as part of their degree course (to reiterate, I’ve been led to believe that they’re very open to this sort of thing). All the students that do the course would have to select a band and film them (you can advise Matthew as to which local acts would be able and willing, and you could act as an ongoing “Consultant”, a mentor for students with specific questions). With an interview section aswell it would I suppose basically be a Toad Session. In fact the template could be a Toad Session so they know roughly the parameters.
At the end of the process you choose the “winner”, “best in show” whatever you want to call it, for the ECA and you’ve also presided over the most in depth interview process you could get. You approach who you think is capable of taking it forward to something more regular, or you don’t approach anyone, your call. Maybe they’ll all be crap, but at least their crap on the ECA’s time and your blog doesn’t get exposed to their novice attempts – they’ll no doubt improve too.
Ultimately if you choose to go ahead with something like this, and you can find someone interested and like-minded you can start doing regular sessions or vlogs or whatever.
You could start with local bands (and keep that going) but in time you could perhaps evolve it into touring bands visiting Edinburgh. Similar to Black Cab/Blogotheque preferably using Edinburgh as that will set you apart.
The student may ultimately get to video touring bands, good ones of course (you’d have a veto, naturally) – that’s incentive/remuneration enough I’d have said.
Obviously that can’t be used as an incentive at the early stage, but if they use their imgination…
You will stand a good chance of getting touring acts to say yes if they see the dedication that has gone into the Song, by Toad website too so that’s why the student would need you.
Finally, Rampant Chutney Consumerism questioned what it would add to a blog like this. I would think of it as an extension of the Toad Sessions – those are a welcome addition to the blog are they not?
Next week, world peace…
You are wasted on Turnips, mate.
Totally, this Turnip cider does funny things to my head.
I meant that genius like that was wasted on Turnips, not that you were plastered. Bloody internets and their lack of vocal inflections.
i not poo pooing outright, however, if it was me i’d want it to be of a certain standard before i put my name to it…..that’s all really, and some of the stuff i’ve seen out there is utter shite.
and yes TT the toad sessions are most welcome awesome…
Love
I’d rather not have to think about you poo pooing, thanks Tom. I’ve just eaten.
I thought that’s what you might have meant but I was taking the safe option and not second guessing a potential compliment…
Always a safe tactic with this crowd, TT, believe you me!
TT – nice ideas. I think there are students out there who’d love to be a part of something like that.
i should really learn how to proof read…esp when it is also part of my actual job!!!
I’ve just been reading some of the Music 2.0 section and linked articles for the past hour. Always a thought-provoking and well-informed read that Music 2.0 bit. I just wanted to say well done overall really. My girlfriend always tells me praise is important, so, keep up the good work! Another great article on a great blog.
And when the recipient is as vain and superficial as myself, praise is appreciated even more!
Matthew, you may know the blog ‘New Music Strategies’, but if not, it is well work a look. Some very progressive stuff on Music 2.0 type things, and nicely written too by an expert in the field.
That’s that one based out in Portland, isn’t it? By the bloke, I think, who runs Pamplemoose and hence puts on Pickathon I think. I may have my facts confused, but the guy’s a legend if I haven’t.
(Of course he’s obviously very clever if he only does one of these things, but two – well that would be something!)
It’s by a chap called Andrew Dubber, who, if I were to cut and paste his biography here (his joke, not mine) I would describe as:
an Arts and Humanities Research Council Knowledge Transfer Fellow in Online Music and Radio Innovation and a Senior Lecturer in the Music Industries at Birmingham City University, UK.
In his spare time I think he hosts whisky tasting events, rides bicycles, plays chess and Go, takes photographs and collects jazz records.
You may indeed have your facts wrong, but I wouldn’t want to say that in front of everyone because I might be wrong too!
Try this sir:
I do – in fact I got myself completely confused. Yes, I know Andrew Dubber. Some of his stuff is really very good indeed, and very very helpful for those of us doing things like starting record labels as well.
What about you Matthew? Songbytoad vlog? you could have a section called Barts corner perhaps and maybe Dylan could be the presenter?