Thanks Guys
As pretty much all of you know, Mrs. Toad and I have been away on holiday in Italy for the last couple of weeks. In our absence Euan (from The Steinberg Principle, Trampoline and The Kays Lavelle) very kindly agreed to write Song, by Toad for me (and for you) to make sure things kept ticking over in our absence. In this he was ably assisted by Bart (from, erm, eagleowl* and pretty much every other band in Scotland), assisted by Dylan (from Blueback Hotrod) and rescued by Tart (from Love Shack, Baby).
Apart from merely thanking them, which I genuinely do, I wanted to say what a fucking great job they did. I knew Bart would do a fine job of the Monday listings because, before he packed it in, his Magic Marker listings page was always the first page I checked before writing my own. Dylan’s general oversight was much appreciated as well, particularly as he wrote Toad himself for two weeks last year, so it was really nice of him to supervise generally, and provide training and the Friday Fives. And Tart, thanks for stepping in and sorting out the filehosting issue, it really is much appreciated.
Most of all, though, it really has to be said and said again what a fantastic job I think Euan did with the site. He and I agree on a lot of music, and disagree on a lot as well, and I think he was a little concerned that he might in some way alienate my readers by posting slightly off-message stuff. Honestly, I think that was actually the strength of his choices. From my perspective, and hopefully from yours, it felt a little like a fresh breeze in a dusty room – I actually thought it was brilliant that he posted slightly different stuff and gave everyone a change.
I also appreciate how much of a community we seem to have, that people are willing to donate their time for no real benefit to themselves and help out, and that really the whole site didn’t skip a beat in my absence. I’ve been trying to think of ways to broaden the participation a little on this site, but have always been a little nervous of loosening the reins, and this was a really good sign that this wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing.
So thanks so much guys, Euan in particular, it really was appreciated and I thought you did a superb job. And for those of you who want to read a little more, please go and check out Euan’s blog, because it really is worth reading.
And while we’re at it, congratulations are in order to Dylan, who has parlayed what began as ‘helping out with some pictures for the Toad Sessions’ into a first paid photography gig. Go here to have a look. They aren’t all his, just “most of the good ones” to quote the man himself.
Maximilian Hecker – Sunburnt Days
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And just to show you that things really are back to normal:
* Bart, you should know that it pains me every single time I have to respectfully decline to capitalise the name of your bloody band. Every damn time.
Agreed. Well done.
*patiently awaits posting of pics from Matthew’s hols*
oh shit, that parrot is truly the bastard son of Matthew and some stoned Frenchie.
(and I did nothing, but thanks anyway, xoxo)
I had fun.
And I really do appreciate the capitalisation thing. Really. If you knew how much it pains me every time I see a gig listing for “Eagle Owl”, you’d understand.
What are you supposed to do if it comes at the start of a sentence? I have specifically (and sometimes rather tortuously) avoided putting it at the start of sentences in the past just so I didn’t have to make that decision.
“Edinburgh’s eagleowl…”
“The excellent eagleowl..”
“Fucking eagleowl…”
Oh, Dev, there will be no pics. We really don’t take pictures of one another, and when we were in Napoli, the most interesting place, we accidentally left the camera in the boot of the car and could never be arsed fetching it.
Gramatically it’s acceptable to have it capitalised at the start of a sentence. However, it looks ugly.
Nice pics by the way Dylan. Is the full set going to appear anytime soon?
i also had fun. thanks for the kind words.
There’s a full set on Future Cinema’s Flickr page.
I didn’t say most of the good ones were mine!
Nic’s got loads of brilliant shots too – as usual!
shockingly eagleowl
I have views on this matter of band names, proper nouns, capitilasation and grammar.
Language is a possesion shared between us all, we each have equal rights and responsibilities regarding its use. It represents communication between each of us as human beings, and as such is essential for us to function as individuals and as members of communities.
Therefore, we must have mutual consensus on its rules, definitions and interpretations in order to be confident that we are expressing ourselves clearly and accurately.
I find myself questioning whether it’s appropriate for an individual entity to intentionally disregard those conventions. For example, band names are proper nouns therefore the rules of the language we share dictate that they should be written in title case.
However, the matter that clouds the issue is that vague and wooly notion of ‘art’.
Does grammar restrict the manner in which an individual can use the written word? Yes, that’s its key function.
Does ‘art’ as an entity have a duty to challenge and confront convention? Of course, that is one of its many key functions.
Does grammar restrict artistic expression? Arguable. Some might say it enhances it.
Now here’s the rub, the unanswerable question: does the artist have the right to disregard grammar in order to make an artistic statement?
On the side of grammar, of course the answer’s no. Correct grammar dictates language, its use and expression. Without grammar it’s impossible to consistently convey your meaning through the medium of the written word.
On the side of art, of course the answer’s yes. Art can do what it wants, challenge what it wants, push whatever convention it wants as far as it wants. That’s one of the sacred defining tenets of the abstract notion of art.
My opinion? I think artists should be free to write their act’s name in whatever format they like on your album and single covers, display and promotional media and so on. Calligraphy and display typography straddle the borders of art, design and written communication. It’s an area of art I particularly enjoy.
However, when it comes to editorial text, I feel the general rules of grammar should be upheld.
So, in terms of band names, write the name however you like on albums and posters. Use that opportunity to express and define the nature of the band through the creativity of display typography. You own that space, use it as you see fit.
In terms of written published prose, well, that’s space we all share. We’ve all reached consensus on how we communicate with each other in that space. That’s what grammar is: the agreement between all speakers of a language on how it should be written down. I don’t think that area necessarily belongs to the band to mess about with. If you’re going to give a band a name that can be spoken, then the rules already exist about how that name should be written down. It’s not, unfortunately, up to you.
Nevertheless, if you’re in a band should you care? Probably not.
I have a thesis too. Using stupid fucking punctuation in your band name is really fucking annoying.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
That’s what I said.
Only with filéts mignon.
I love that story about Duran Duran, I’m sure I’ve recounted it here before..
During one of their many comebacks in the early 1990s their name was suddenly appearing everywhere; in the press, TV captions etc. as ‘duranduran’, without the capital letters and the space.
They were on the TV being interviewed, and the presenter asked them why they’d decided to change the name, and Nick Rhodes goes “We didn’t! We just saw some album artwork we liked!”
Dylan – Oh my fucking God….can you really be bothered…..jesus fucking christ…. you worry me big time
rules are there to be fucked with
Grammar my arse, i’m dyslexic and find that grammar is only there to make you feel thick if you don’t get it
smiley fucking face
No more so, Chutters, than arithmetic only being there to make you feel thick if you can’t count.
i beg to differ…….
Chutters, while I have every sympathy with you and those who suffer with dyslexia, I don’t think it gives you grounds to protest against maintaining a sound notion of grammar in language.
If you’ll forgive the poor taste analogy; you don’t see blind people protesting against light bulbs.
I usually write eagleowl with an initial lower case. I just think it looks nicer.
I like it when people take the care and attention to do the same, but I don’t get upset when people use a capital. I do get upset when people write ‘eagle owl’, as that is not the name of the band. I have asked people to change it in the past. This probably makes me sound like a complete dick, but I’m comfotrtable with that to an extent.
And besides, it’s not like we’re iLiKETRAiNS or anything.
thats a stupid bloody analogy….really is
try harder
thank christ you;re nowt like Iliketrains….pish tastic
It’s spelt iLiKETRAiNS, Tom.
pedant
i write eagleowl. i write iliketrains. i write in small letters regularly cause i can’t be bothered using shift or caps lock. so bite me.
Sorry to butt in (and be pedantic) but the bands logo is now I LIKE TRAINS as far as i’m aware.
Wilf, stop oppressing Chutters.
Euan, it’s still wrong though, isn’t it.
Christ, he’s right though. I LIKE TRAINS it is! Good riddance to that shift-finger sprainingly annoying spelling.
it’s not wrong. there’s no law against it. i don’t feel dirty for doing it. however, if you mean would i write a letter or report without capitals and proper punctuation, then no i wouldn’t. would i write abook without them? why, yes i would. cormack mccarthy did with no country for old men. did that annoy you?
our new logo on the album is tHe KaYS laVELLe
No, it’s I Like Trains.
It’s not up to them.
Euan, it’s not illegal but it is nevertheless wrong. And yes, writing a novel without capitalisation is fucking annoying, not least because it’s bloody pointless.
The question is was McCarthy doing it to make some artistic statement about the characters in his novel and their story?
Or was he being a pretentious, obstinate cock?
MacCarthy is one of the best writers around…fact…he can do what the fuck he wants
what makes it pretentious??? maybe like me he’s just lazy?! does it have to be so complicated?
But why?
If you’re going to break the rules, or disrupt conventions, fine. Great, but have a goal in mind, otherwise it’s just pointless and childish and devalues everyone’s efforts.
I’m reminded of the coversation we were having on the Gobble Gobble thread the other day.
If your tunes are good enough, why obscure them to that degree? If you’re not happy with them, why publish them?
The same goes for Cormac McCarthy. If the novel is good enough to attract attention without daft punctuation lunacy, then why do it?
If it’s a whole novel, Euan, it’s unlikely to be laziness.
life is for living….not adhering
Yeah, but what he typed into his computer isn’t exactly what was printed on the pages of the book.
His manuscript has been edited, approved for publication, proof-read, typeset and printed.
At each atage in the process the cut-and-dried decision to keep it lower case has been passed along.
What was behind that decision? If it was just laziness then it wouldn’t have made it onto the shelves at Waterstones, even if the book itself did.
why not? perhaps his editor was also lazy?!
i don’t see why you’re getting worked up about punctuation. my english teacher when i was in primary 6 took my essay and tore it up in front of the class cause of my punctuation. that was horrible. you remind me of her. anyways, i ended up getting an A in english. but what i wrote was not better because of my punctuation or because i used capitals. it was good cause it was good. i actually like not using capitals.
do you care?
i just read the book, it was great.
then i read the road, it was even better…..
I love the fact that a post thanking Euan for all his hard work over the last two weeks has descended into a full scale argument about punctuation.
Welcome home, Matthew.
hahaha.
Beautifully punctuated, Bart.
i was just thinking…..Matthew should open up the blog to other contributors….i really enjoyed the past couple of weeks….still want Toad to post….but it would bring out the whole community thing a lot more…..
what do you reckon?
I agree, actually. Just not sure how best to do it. Suggestions welcome.
i wouldn’t suggest a free-for-all….but i would say it has to be editorially free….in the sense the boss can’t censor…..a list of 5-7 writers who can submit 2-3 times a month
but at the end of the day, it’s your blog pal…..it’s your shout
I would agree that there’s no point in inviting other people to contribute if I were then to try and control their contributions. It would rather defeat the purpose, and seems against the spirit of thing – provided they were all spelled correctly and gramatically correct.
A small list of other contributors would be nice. They could submit a small flurry of posts at a time – three or four maybe.
I’m keen to avoid diluting the coherence of the ‘voice’ too much, though, and I also don’t want to overwhelm people with too many posts in a day. Two or three in total seems like a reasonable limit to me.
totally….
the voice? is that yours, the geography or the music?
Mine, as much as anything. I’m very possessive about Toad things, as you may have guessed. And I think that consistency makes for what a media person might call a very distinctive brand. Step too far away from that and things might lose their character a little. Not if it’s done well, of course.
I think I know what you mean.
You want us to swear a lot?
And drink more.
fair enough…..i think the various voices could/would add a lot to the blog….but you do need the toadness to be the underlying momentum of the blog.
Quick reply because the conversation has moved on while I’ve actually been busy doing work!
It is important. If we abandon grammar we lose the ability to express ourselves through the medium of the written word. However, that’s not to say it’s appropriate to humiliate small children over it.
You started it.
and you well and truly finished it
Darn it, i have missed a good argument – i would have enjoyed that one too – grammar and punctuation are the bane of my life! Drop a comma, Dylan, liberate yourself from the guidlines, i assure you no one will suffer!*
I have enjoyed the last couple of weeks alot – well done to Euan, Bart and Dylan. I like Tom’s idea – a feature writer every now and then, to bring something different to the table…
*Please don’t feel the need to write and essay about my opinion Dylan… apathy set in half way down that post!
Only halfway down?..
What’s the photo of the sinking car about, Matthew?
“If we abandon grammar we lose the ability to express ourselves through the medium of the written word.”
and if we don’t hold books in our hands we’ll lose the ability to read. and if we don’t pay for music we’ll lose the ability to appreciate it. and if we don’t call our teachers by their surnames we’ll lose the ability to learn from them. and if we don’t cross the street at the corner crossing we’ll lose the ability to govern our youth. blah blah blah blah
when did you become a conservative minded, rules-following, member of the Toad Stasi?
fuck the rules, think for yourself, do as you wish without harm to another, give a lot of your money away and fuck your friends for the fun of it.
there, that’s simple enough isn’t it?
If we don’t, hold books in our hands well.
Lose the ability to read, and if we don’t, pay for music well.
Lose the ability to appreciate it, and if we don’t, call our teachers.
By their surnames, we’ll lose the ability.
To learn from them; and if we don’t, cross the street.
At the corner crossing well, lose the ability to govern.
Our youth?..
oh jeez dylan. stop talking!
The mind fucking boggles.
This is why Americans have guns.
Dylan – my FUCKING head hurts…FUCKING stop it PLEASE
Although it does bear remembering that the rules benefit the conservative and the rebel alike.
Grammar, although much more flexible than many think, is an inherent part of language. It is as important as the words themselves, if not more so. Anyone thinking it can be done without is simply an idiot. Anyone thinking it shouldn’t be fucked with is of course being silly, but grammar isn’t just ‘important’, without it language simply doesn’t exist, and you lot bloody well know it.
“Pedant” = best comment ever.
Matthew, was joking about the pics–you’re sort of like the Loch Ness Toad, aren’t you..?
There are pictures on Facebook, but they are all taken by people in pubs and therefore of a type that I hope my mother never sees.
As my last post so deftly demonstrates
, words alone are malleable and almost meaningless without the grammar to define them and fix their meaning down.
Words are like building bricks, you can stack them up in any variety of shapes, but the stack won’t be very stable, and might not keep the rain out or stand up to the wind.
Grammar is the mortar and cement that hold the bricks in place and give strength and structure to the building.
dylan’s back on this thread. great.
With filets mignon.
Euan hasn’t contributed anything of substance to this thread since that heart-wrenching tale about his traumatic childhood experiences at the hands of his evil English teacher.
He’s just popping in and out to grouch about other people having a discussion.
I would have thought he could either read it and learn some of what he missed in grade 6 English, perhaps contribute if he has a point to make, or alternatively just go and read something else.
Are you accusing someone else of making frivolous, off-topic comments for no obvious reason?
No, I’m accusing someone of unwarranted, unsupported, pointless grouching for grouching’s sake.
actually dylan, i wasn’t grouching for grouching sake. i was grouching about the amount of shite spewing from your brain and onto this thread – therefore warranted. matthew made your point in about 2 sentences. i believe shonagh, tart and chutters were in agreement with me(therefore supported) but as usual, we are all wrong, you are right and i bow to your superior knowledge, wit and intelligence.
however, the only pointless thing on this thread is your tedious ramblings about grammar.
Dylan, you wrote more in a comment on the acceptable typesetting of band names than I wrote in the initial post. Apart from Chutters’ “I think grammar’s a load of shit because I’m crap at it”, you have written the craziest comment on the thread and are now being mocked for it. This is entirely justified, don’t you think?
Take your medicine like a good boy.
THERE ARE SEVENTEEN FUCKING COMMENTS ON THIS FUCKING THREAD DIGGING PERSONALLY AND DIRECTLY AT ME – I MAKE ONE DIG BACK AND I GET HAULED OVER THE COALS FOR IT?!!!
FUCK YOU ALL!!!
Stop being a cock, Dylan.
Dylan you’re such a dick.
God, isn’t that Dylan guy an asshole.
Fucking Dylan clearly thinks he’s better than anyone else. What a tool.
I wish that buttmunch Dylan would shut the fuck up.
Twenty-two..
Dylan really gets on my nerves.
again D – if there’s 18 comments then I guess my comments were supported after all.
we’re only playing with you. dry your eyes.
This would be such a good thread if it wasn’t for that tit Dylan.
I hate Dylan.
Yeah, let’s find out where he lives and beat him up, the bumclown.
I am never going to read this site again because I hate Dylan so much.
I heard that Dylan killed Michael Jackson.
And the little baby Jeebus. Lynch him!
I used to like Dylan, but not anymore. Now I FUCKING HATE HIM!
“Insert smiley face here”
poor d.
Dylan – did you get all the random names out of grammatically correct Enid Blyton book?
Erm, no Chutters, that was me.
nasty man Toad!!!
hahah even tho I was warned to no revisit this thread upon pain of self-immolation, I must say this is the best thread in a good long while!
gawd, you lot do make me laugh over here!